John Frost
Edmund Frost
(1593-1672)

 

Family Links

Spouses/Children:
Thomazine Clenche

Edmund Frost

  • Born: 28 Aug 1593, Hartest, Suffolk, England
  • Marriage: Thomazine Clenche on 16 Apr 1634 in Earls Colne, Essex, England
  • Died: Jul 1672, Cambridge, Middlesex, England at age 78
picture

bullet  General Notes:

A "preaching elder" forced to leave England under an assumed name because he dissented from church views. Settled immediately in 1635 in Cambridge with first wife and son John. One of original members of First Congregationalist Church of Cambridge. Made elder 1636. m 1 1630 Thomazine, not Belgrave (who may have actually married Edward Frost) in Hartest, Suffolk, England. She d 6/13/1653 Sudbury MA m 2 Mary c 1653 d bef 1669 m 3 Reana c 1669 d bef 11/3/1665 m 1 Edmund Jaes bef 1640, m 2 William Andrews (-1652) c8/11/1640 3 Robert Daniel (-1655( 5/2/1654

This would give Edmund powerful Puritan connections, but I do not have on what this parentage is based. Moreover, the list of children that I have does not include alleged Frost sisters Alice, Elizabeth, OR Thomasine.

His father was allegedly John Frost, a minister persecuted by Archbishop Laud.

He was married To Thomazine Clenche by Rev. Shepherd, whose group he belonged to. SeeSee Thompson, Neil D., "The English Ancestry of Thomasine (Clench) Frost, First Wife of Edmund Frost of Cambridge, Massachusetts," in New England Historical and Genealogical Register, vol. 153 (July 1999), pp. 279, 289.


I have dates of birth Aug 28 1573 and Aug 28 1593. There appears to be an effort to make him a child of John the Younger, father of Edward Frost, Glemsford adn Hartest, but this doesn't match up.

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ate: Wed, 21 Apr 2004 14:50:58 EDT
From: <RobinVanM@aol.com>
To: FROST-L@rootsweb.com
Message-ID: <1da.1f850011.2db81c92@aol.com>
Subject: Edmund Frost, son James
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"

Edmund Frost is the first American ancestor for many of us. For you and
Darlene Frost Kneaves, this is what I've found so far. I believe Edmund:
-was born in Hartest, Suffolk County, England Aug. 28, 1593.
The following two books led me to look at Hartest and dates around 1593:
The Frost
Family in England and America with Special Reference to Edmund Frost and
Some of
His Descendants,Thomas G. Frost and Edward L. Frost (Russell Printing
Co.,
Buffalo,NY,1909) and Frost Genealogy in Five Families, Norman Seaver
Frost, (Frost
Family Assn. of America, West Newton, MA, 1926) reprinted by Higginson
Book Co.

The parish transcripts from Hartest 1556-1784, Family History Library
(FHL) film
0991936 show only one Edmund Frost born between 1556 and 1620, the one
born
Aug. 28, 1593. "Our" Edmund's birth could have been erroneously omitted,
but
I believe this is the right one.
-was the son of John Frost.
The books also point to John as Edmund's father and many trees said he
was born in
or around 1570.

The transcripts show only two John Frosts born in
Hartest between
1565 and 1575: May 30, 1568 and March 17,1572. The father of both John
Frosts
was John Frost. The second birth has "carpr." next to John the father's
name,
apparently to differentiate John the carpenter from the John who had
"sexton" in the
margins for a different child's birth. Again, this could be wrong, but I
think one of these
two Johns was Edmund's father. If Edmund was born in 1593, the earliest
his father
could have died was 1592. There was a John Frost sho died Sept.6, 1606
who was "son
of Hen.[ry] of Glemsford.

This may have given rise to the
Edmund-born-in-Glemsford,
England belief that I saw in some Frost family trees that didn't have
documentation.
Other John Frosts died Mar. 20, 1607, Feb. 2, 1609, and Feb. 9, 1609.
According to
Hartest: A Village History, ed. Clive Paine (Hartest Local History Group,
Lavenham Press
Lavenham, England, 1999) the last two are son and father, and the
father's will didn't
mention a son Edmund. This means the John Frost who died in 1607 might
have been
Edmund's father.

-was the grandson of John Frost. See information above.
-was married to Thomasine Clench whose parentage is known.
The Frost books and other sources say his wife was Thomasine Belgrave or
Clench.
Neil Thompson reported his research in "The English Ancestry of Thomasine
(Clench)
Frost, First Wife of Edmund Frost of Cambridge, Massachusetts," New
England
Historical and Genealogical Register, July 1999.

Microfilmed parish
register records
from the town of Earls Colne, Essex County, England show Reverend Thomas
Shepard
married Edmund Frost and Thomasine "Clenche" Apr. 16, 1634. This is
significant
because Edmund and Thomasine came to America with Shepard.

Thomasine was
baptized Oct.6,1608 at Bottisham, Cambridgeshire, the 7th of 8 children
of Robert Clench
and Joan Webbe. Robert was baptized at Coddenham, Suffolk County June 22,
1572 with
his twin sister Anne, and died at Witcham, Cambridgeshire before July 12,
1633 when
his will was "proved." Joan was born about 1579, the daughter of Thomas
Webbe and
Susanna Smyth, and died after June 1610 when her oldest child was
baptized. Robert
was a landowner in Bottisham and moved to Witcham, Isle of Ely after
1610. Robert was
one of 13 children of John Clench and Katherine Almott. John was
probably born in
Wethersfield, Essex around 1533, and died in Holbrook, Suffolk Aug. 18 or
19, 1607.
Katherine was born around 1534, the daughter of Thomas Almott and Bridget
of Creeting
All Saints, Suffolk. Bridget's surname was possibly Thorne. John Clench
was a judge
who, according to Thompson, was "a favorite of Queen Elizabeth I who
called him 'her
good judge.'" The judge's father, Edmund's great-grandfather, was John
clenche of
Wethersfield, Essex, whose parents are unkknown. In his will he called
himself a
husbandman, which means farmer, although he owned some land and leased
other land.
Around 1525 he married Joan Amias, daughter of John Amias, "gentleman."
I think some of the Thomasine Clench-Belgrave confusion is due to the
fact that there
was a Thomasine Frost, a descendent of John Strutt (Strut) of Glemsford,
who married
Edmund Rice and immigrated to Sudbury, MA.
-had his first son John in England in 1635.
Books and trees give various dates, but people usually had their first
child about a year
after they were married, and Edmund and Thomasine were married Apr. 16,
1634. I
didn't find a birth of a John Frost around this time in the Hartest
records, but since they
were married in Earls Colne, it may have occurred there. I haven't
ordered the Earls
Colne microfilm yet.
Re: Edmund's son James. I'm not descended from him, but the Frost Family
book says
James was Edmund and Thomasine's sixth child born 9,2,1643 old system
(Apr. 9,
1643). He "settled in Billerica and m. Rebecca Hamlet, Dec. 17, 1664;
she d. Aug. 20,
1666 and he m. Elizabeth, dau. of Thos. Foster, Jan. 22, 1666-7. His
children were
James, b. Aug. 14, 1666; Thomas, b. Oct. 18, 1667; John, b. Nov.14, 1668,
d. Mar.
3,1668-9; Samuel, b. Feb. 28, 1669-70; Elizabeth b.Nov.6,1672, m. Peter
Cornell;
Edmund b. May 14, d.May 18, 1675; Sarah b.July 15, 1678, m.--Howard;
Hannah
b.Jan.31,1680-1; Joseph, b.Mar.21,1682-3; Abigail b.Aug.23,1685,
m.Ephraim Kidder;
Benjamin, b.Mar.8,1687-8, and Mary, who m. John Walker. James the f. was
deacon of
the Billerica church and died Aug. 12, 1711, a.71; his wife Elizabeth,
survived. He was a
soldier against Weymesit Indians, Billerica garrison, 1675." The Frost
Genealogy book
takes James' line through nine generations who lived in MA, NH, and VT,
but none in
Maine (the MA towns are in what is now MA). Darlene - e-mail me your
snail mail
address if you want me to send you a photocopy of the James generations.

Hope this helps the Edmund descendants.
Robin in maryland

Discussion on Frost-l with above individual, Nov 10 and 11, 2005

I think some family histories have confused Thomasine Belgrave, who married Edmund Rice and lived in Sudbury, MA with Thomasine Clenche, who married Edmund Frost and lived in Cambridge, MA. The best source of info on Thomasine Clench Frost is probably an article by Neil Thompson, "The English Ancestry of Thomasine (Clench) Frost, First Wife of Edmund Frost of Cambridge, Massachusetts," in the July 1999 New England Historic and Genealogic Register. All dates are month,day,year and all locations England unless otherwise specified. Thompson's information is based on church records. He said Thomasine was baptized 10/6/1608 in Bottisham, Cambridgeshire, the daughter of Robert and Joan (Webbe) Clench. Robert was baptized at Coddenham, Suffolk, with his twin sister Anne and died at Witcham, Cambridgeshire before 7/12/1633 when his will was "proved." Joan was born about 1579, the daughter of Thomas and Susanna(Smyth) Webbe, and died after 6/1610 when her oldest child was baptized.Robert was a landowner in Bottisham, but moved to Witcham, Isle of Ely after 1610. Earlier parish registers don't exist, the Bishop's Transcripts are incomplete, and there is no burial record for Robert, Joan, or his second wife. Robert was the son of John Clench, "the Judge," who was probably born in Wethersfield, Essex around 1533, died in Holbrook, Suffolk Aug. 18 or 19, 1607. John married Katherine Almott around 1555. Katherine was born around 1534, the daughter of Thomas Almott and Bridget (possible surname Thorne) of Creeting All Saints, Suffolk. Thompson said Judge Clench had a "distinguished" career and "is said to have been a favorite of Queen Elizabeth I who called him 'her good judge.'" When he died he had lands in Harkstead, Grundisburgh, Clopton, Kirton, Holbrook, Great Bealings, and Bramford in Suffolk County (I couldn't find these on a map), but he didn't leave an estate record. At various times the family lived in Creeting All Saints, Crowfield in Coddenham, and Holbrook in Suffolk. John's father was John Clench of Wethersfield, Essex, parents unknown. In his will he called himself a husbandman, which means farmer, although he had "freehold" land, which means land owned free and clear, and "copyhold" land which means "a tenure of property proved by a written transcript of record in the rolls of a manorial court," according to the dictionary. Around 1525 John married Joan Amias, daughter of John Amias "gentleman." Thompson said Edmund Frost and Thomasine "Clenche" were married 4/16/1634 by Reverend Thomas Shepard in Earls Colne, Essex County. This is significant because Edmund and Thomasine came to the colonies with Shepard and the rest of his congregation. I found a birth record for an Edmund Frost in theHartest, Suffolk County parish records on 8/28/1593. His father's name was John.Family histories say Edmund's father was born in or around 1570. I found only two John Frosts born in Hartest between 1565 and 1575, one 5/30/1568 and one 3/17/1572 who had "carpr." written next to his name. The father of both John Frosts was also John Frost. Hope this helps. Robin in Maryland

Dora Smith asked why some believe Edmund Frost's father was a clergymannamed John who was persecuted by Laud. Unfortunately, the two major Edmund Frost genealogies don't give any sources. When I've checked their data against original records, I found the genealogies were accurate almost all the time. However, church records, called parish registers, didn't begin in England until 1538. Edmund and Thomasine were married by Reverend Thomas Shepard and emigrated with him. Shepard's autobiography describes his persecution by Laud. I don't know if John Frost of Hartest was Edmund's father. I believe he was because the family histories say Edmund was born in Hartest and the only birth record I found in the parish records had an Edmund whose father was John. The Hartest Local History Group also believes Edmund was born to John in Hartest on 8/28/1593. Their book Hartest: A Village History includes two JohnFrosts, a tanner who died in 1661 and a weaver who died in 1644. I don't know if these are relatives. Some Frost histories give various dates for Edmund's birth, and some say he was born in Glemsford. I read parish records transcribed in 1941, when England was being bombed regularly. I'm guessing they were done to make sure a copy survived. The handwriting in the originals is the worst I've ever seen, so there could be errors. However, I only saw one Edmund Frost born in Glemsford, a twin to John born in 1564. I read transcribed Hartest records from 1556-1635 and only found one Edmund born 8/28/1593 to John. Was Robert the son of a prominent judge? The genealogist who published the article checked original records when he could, transcribed articles when he couldn't. The NEHGS has a high standard for publication, so I give their articles a lot of credibility. Was Edmund an ordained minister or a church elder? I've read the records of the town and church of Cambridge, MA (originally called the New Towne or Newtown) which say he was one of the first two church elders. The records often refer to him as Elder Frost. The town didn't have a minister from 1668-71 so church officials including Edmund were given the responsibility for "cathechizing the youth" which meant making sure they had memorized religious material printed in Q&A format. Edmund was poor, and the church occasionally gave him money food, or other items. Robin in Maryland ==== FROST Mailing List ==== Don't forget to post your e-mail address so that others can answer you directly.

Dora Smith asked why some believe Edmund Frost's father was a clergymannamed John who was persecuted by Laud. Unfortunately, the two major Edmund Frost genealogies don't give any sources. When I've checked their data against original records, I found the genealogies were accurate almost all the time. However, church records, called parish registers, didn't begin in England until 1538. Edmund and Thomasine were married by Reverend Thomas Shepard and emigrated with him. Shepard's autobiography describes his persecution by Laud. I don't know if John Frost of Hartest was Edmund's father. I believe he was because the family histories say Edmund was born in Hartest and the only birth record I found in the parish records had an Edmund whose father was John. The Hartest Local History Group also believes Edmund was born to John in Hartest on 8/28/1593. Their book Hartest: A Village History includes two JohnFrosts, a tanner who died in 1661 and a weaver who died in 1644. I don't know if these are relatives. Some Frost histories give various dates for Edmund's birth, and some say he was born in Glemsford. I read parish records transcribed in 1941, when England was being bombed regularly. I'm guessing they were done to make sure a copy survived. The handwriting in the originals is the worst I've ever seen, so there could be errors. However, I only saw one Edmund Frost born in Glemsford, a twin to John born in 1564. I read transcribed Hartest records from 1556-1635 and only found one Edmund born 8/28/1593 to John. Was Robert the son of a prominent judge? The genealogist who published the article checked original records when he could, transcribed articles when he couldn't. The NEHGS has a high standard for publication, so I give their articles a lot of credibility. Was Edmund an ordained minister or a church elder? I've read the records of the town and church of Cambridge, MA (originally called the New Towne or Newtown) which say he was one of the first two church elders. The records often refer to him as Elder Frost. The town didn't have a minister from 1668-71 so church officials including Edmund were given the responsibility for "cathechizing the youth" which meant making sure they had memorized religious material printed in Q&A format. Edmund was poor, and the church occasionally gave him money food, or other items. Robin in Maryland ==== FROST Mailing List ==== Don't forget to post your e-mail address so that others can answeryou directly.


picture

Edmund married Thomazine Clenche, daughter of Robert Clenche and Joan Webbe, on 16 Apr 1634 in Earls Colne, Essex, England. (Thomazine Clenche was christened on 6 Oct 1608 in Bottisham, Cambridgeshire, England and died on 13 Jun 1653 in Sudbury, Ma.)




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